Dimmable?

Very few LED lamps are dimmable.  If an LED lamp is dimmable it will usually be pointed out in the description of the LED lamp.  Some LED lamps can be damaged by trying to use them with a dimmer.  Also, there are different types of dimmers and an LED lamp may be compatible with just certain types.

 

I too have many dimmer/switched fixtures in my house and would like to use LED lamps in them but instead must resort to dimmable CFLs.  As the LED lamp technology matures we should see a larger selection of dimmable LED lamps.

As far as LED Dimming goes, most of our products are dimmable. It's all a matter of LED Driver technology allowing this to happen.

 

Our LED MR-16s are dimmable with Lutron divers using special dimming controllers and drivers.

 

That being said, I don't see LEDs being dimmable with existing household dimmers any time soon. And when they do become dimmable, initially, they will most likely be step dimming like the EarthLED bulb.

Thanks LEDWaves - the EarthLED folks emailed me about that a bit ago and I posted in the forums...here's the relevant excerpt about the step dimming:

 

"allow the person to select a suitable lighting level by simply switching the bulb on and off rapidly. With this functionality which we term "EvoDim" the user can select through three different settings. Additionally, the bulb remembers its last setting, its really cool and works well for turning an regular lamp into a night light and instantly back into a reading light."

 

As I mentioned, there are some that claim to be dimmable with existing household dimmers.  The Lighting Science R30 lamp for example (link escapes me at the moment).  I have eight of them but I have not tried one on a dimmer yet.

It's a little bit misleading to say it's dimmable. Is it a smooth dim or step dimming?

Here you go:

 

http://www.trinorthlighting.com/SPEC_SAVI_LED_R30.pdf

Here's another example I just ran across:

 

http://www.ledsource.com/Catalog/White-LED-Replacement-Lamps/eW-Profile-Powercore

 

It says "Controllable via commercially available dimmers".

Another one I just found:

 

http://www.arraylighting.com/

 

"...dimmable on standard commercial dimmers..."

Here's one I bought earlier this year that said it was dimmable and definitely was not:

 

graphics.greenandmore.com/img/LL-LI-E507-1-500.jpg

 

I hope to have better luck with the 6-watt LumiSelect model on this page, from EarthLED, recently ordered:

 

www.earthled.com/lumiselect-dimmable-led-light-bulbs.html

 

And I just ran into these yesterday, Array Lamps from MyLightStore.com:

 

www.mylightstore.com/

 

Most of them say "fully dimmable on any standard dimmer", I just ordered the PAR16 model to try them out.

The reason LED's are so hard to dim, is because they run on a wide range of voltage.

 

 

I received both the Array Lighting LED lamp and the EarthLED LumiSelect LED lamp over the last week.  I am pleased with the performance of the Array Lighting LED lamp (PAR16), except it still does not work on the dimmer I tried it on.  The LumiSelect lamp from EarthLED also does not work on the dimmer I tried it on, I'll try a couple more around the house to be sure.  Also, the LumiSelect claimed 6 watts of power consumption, the box it came in claimed 5 watts, and the Watt's Up wattmeter measure it at 7.9 watts, so I'm considering returning that one.  The PAR16 by Array Lighting's measurements line up well with their specifications (both power consumption and luminous output).

 

I'll be writing a review here of both LED lamps in the near future.

 

How are the color temperatures of those bulbs?  I know that was a big issue for folks who tried out the Costco brand bulbs: http://greenhome.huddler.com/forum/thread/1141/costco-brand-led-floodlights-on-the-cheap

 

I have no problem with the color temperatures of those new LED lamps, but then I prefer the "Daylight White" color to the more yellowish "Warm White".

 

The Array Lighting lamp says 5000K on both the website and the box it came in.  This is their "Natural White", compared to their "Warm White" at 3000K and "Cool White" at 6500K.  Viewed by itself I can't see any yellow or blue tint to it.

 

The EarthLED lamp says 5500K on the website, but 6000K on the box it came in.  Viewed by itself it's hard to see any blue tint, maybe just the slightest hint of blue, but putting the two lamps side-by-side the Array Lighting lamp does show up a bit more yellow/less blue than the EarthLED lamp.

 

I have an email into both companies about the dimming problem, EarthLED has replied already, nothing from Mylightstore.com yet about the Array Lighting LED lamp.

Bobkart, I am considering purchasing a number of the PAR LumiSelects from EarthLED.  They have a youtube video clearly showing that they work with a standard rotary dimmer.  What type of dimmer did you use?  I will be using home automation INSTEON dimmer modules.  I purchased some other LED pars in the past that worked ok, but their step dimming was horrific compared to the demo in that youtube video.  If you have any other product recommendations, that would be great.  I am not able to use other dimmers, as my entire system runs insteon, but wanted to get any feedback from you if possible.

Thanks....

Hi Joe, welcome to Ecohuddle.

I've been meaning to write a review here for that LumiSelect PAR16.  Life is keeping me busy.

I have a somewhat lengthy email exchange with "Mark" at EarthLed (not Mark Costigliola who has appeared here at Ecohuddle a time or two) about that lamp and the problems I have with it.  I'll try to sum it up here, and write a review here soon also.

Right away I noticed two problems, one being that the power consumption and light output is very different between a "no dimmer" configuration and a "dimmer on full" configuration.  The other problem (and this one is a bit hard to describe) is that the dimming effect of the dimmer on the lamp all happens in a very short range of travel (much less than one half) of the dimmer switch itself (more detail below).  Initially Mark thought that the dimmer I was using might be the problem, it was the least-expensive Lutron model I could find at Home Depot near my house.  He sent me a video of the LED lamp in question being dimmed up and down, that much I could replicate, the video did not address either problem I was experiencing.

Eventually I got a dimmer model/number and link from him:

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100089584

And I eventually had one sent to me (they're apparently not available in the stores).

Wiring that up in my testbed did reveal an improvement in the dimming performance, but only slightly.  The power consumption problem was still there: it consumes around 7.6 watts with no dimmer in the circuit and around 4.7 watts with the specified dimmer in the circuit, turned all the way up.  Light output is proportionately diminished with the dimmer in the circuit, so at least the efficiency isn't taking a hit, you just can't get full output with the dimmer involved.  For reference, their website advertised the LED lamp at 6 watts and the box it came in claimed 5 watts.

More detail on the "dimming range" problem: with the dimmer switch in the full on position, light output is at maximum of course (as high as it gets with the dimmer involved anyway).  Move the dimmer switch down to, say 75% of the way from the lowest position to the highest position and you get an obvious reduction in light output.  But somewhere above 50%, from there down there is no further reduction in light output.  You can move the dimmer switch up and down in the lower half of its range of motion and not see any change in light output from the lamp (it is at its minimum output the whole time).  Thus the effectiveness of the dimmer switch is reduced by at least half, you are forced to make very small movements of the slider to accomplish changes that should be achievable with less minute movements.  This may be acceptable to some, I find it just barely acceptable, but combined with the power consumption problem, I chose not purchase any more of these LED lamps, it is sitting on a shelf in its box (along with many other "failed" LED lamps).

All in all I cannot recommend the LumiSelect PAR16.  At most I would advise trying just one in your proposed setup as I did, to determine their suitability.  That way you're only out the $70 instead of many times that if they do not work out.

Regarding other recommendations for dimmable LED lamps, they are still hard to find, but the situation is improving, the only LED lamp I am using now in a dimmable application is two of these in a "three way" dimming touch lamp:

http://www.mylightstore.com/Par16_p/ae26r16nw60.htm

They work fine in that application, each time I touch the lamp I get a reliable change to the next brightness level, just as you would with incandescent bulbs.  So it may be that those Array Lighting LED lamps will work with your setup, the only way to be sure is to try one, but don't expect any help from MyLightStore.com, my emails to them about the PAR30 LED lamp I got from them that didn't work with the first dimmer I tried the LumiSelect with went unanswered (as did the final email about the LumiSelect to Mark at EarthLED once I tried it with the dimmer he directed me to).

Hi Bob, I purchased a PAR30 warm white LumiSelect LED bulb from EarthLED recently and have been pretty impressed for the most part.  I haven't really seen the dimming issues that you are seeing, with the lack of range above a certain threshold.  It does suffer from the same problem that most of these LED bulbs have, which is that they must 'pop' on at a certain light level and will not gradually ramp on like traditional incandescents.  It could be the dimmer itself, which is an INSTEON SwitchLinc, but I am not sure.  If I could drive the LEDs directly with low-voltage I'm sure it wouldn't be a problem.  It could be the lumiselect and transformer technology that prevents that soft 'ramp-on' that we're all used to with incandescents/halogens.

The other issue is that it seems that the bulb is susceptible to the power-line signals from the INSTEON network and there is occaisional flickering going on with the bulb.  Mark is working through a potential solution for me.  I would hate to upgrade everything in my home and then have everything flickering.

I have not tried it out without being on the dimmer, but I am really impressed with the light output so far.  Especially the color temperature of it.  Far better than other LED bulbs I've tried over the years.

Of course, many of these technical problems are because we are still in the early stages of solid state lighting.  I've been dying to jump on the bandwagon and completely convert over, but sometimes these little things are enough of an annoyance to want to wait another few years until everything is worked out.

Only time will tell..........